ศาลาชุมนุม

[daichikyun]

Is the initial sound of ข, ค and ฆ the "k" in "kettle", or closer to the "ch" in German "acht"? I've been hearing them both on different sites.

[Richard Wordingham]

In Standard Thai, nearer to 'kettle'. However, as you have spotted, there is some free variation with the ach-laut. In Northern Thailand, the ach-laut predominates/predominated.

[Rick Bradford]

I have also noticed in words such as ใคร, when a speaker drops the 'r' from the initial cluster, the resulting sound often has a, er, 'ach-laut' quality (voiceless velar fricative).

But maybe that is simply because, as noted above, speakers who drop the 'r' are already at a distance from Standard Thai.

[daichikyun]

Oh, I see. ^^ Thanks for the help~

[Richard Wordingham]

I have also noticed in words such as ใคร, when a speaker drops the 'r' from the initial cluster, the resulting sound often has a, er, 'ach-laut' quality (voiceless velar fricative).

There are several Tai dialects where such a dropping of /r/ aspirates the previous stop, but the only one I was aware of in Thailand was Northern Thai, where the velar aspirate and fricative have merged. Moreover, where they are distinguished, as is (was?) the case in Tai Lue, velar stop plus /r/ yields the aspirate, not the fricative.

[r2d2]

"k" in "kettle", or closer to the "ch" in German "acht"?

For information only: Only within German language you differentiate further in the "(German) ich-" and "(German) ach-"laut because the single, not further differentiating German spelling ch (except sch = English /sh/) causes two different pronunciations, depending on the preceding vowel. An initial ch-laut, and that's what discussed here, does not exist in German spelling. If it occurs, such as in the Arab loan Chemie, it causes long linguistic discussion how to pronunce it (most frequent recommendation "as in ข, ค and ฆ").

For information only.