ศาลาชุมนุม

[bambooboy]

Can you guys help me with this phrase? I read it in this sentence: 4 ร้านอาหารเชียงรายที่ขำไม่ออก

[Pirin]

The context or the situation when you found the phrase will provide others the clue.

[bambooboy]

Oh, it was from the Chiang Rai Focus forum: http://www.chiangraifocus.com/forums/in ... c=907580.0

The whole thread title: 4ร้านอาหารเชียงรายที่ขำไม่ออก.. ถ้ามันเป็นความโชคร้ายของผมคนเดียวในครั้งนี้

[David and Bui]

Thanks for posting this. I'd like to take a shot:


4ร้านอาหารเชียงรายที่ขำไม่ออก.. ถ้ามันเป็นความโชคร้ายของผมคนเดียวในครั้งนี้
Four Chiangrai restaurant which I can't laugh about; perhaps it was just bad luck that these incidents happened to me.

วานนี้ซื้ออาหารหลายอย่าง ตอนซื้อน้ำลายไหล ตอนเปิดน้ำตาไหล
Today I bought a number of different types of food. When I made the purchase, I salivated; when I opened the package to eat them, I cried [with disappointment].

1. ซื้อบะหมี่ชื่อจีนเจ้าดัง(ครั้งแรก) เพราะจะมา รพ.ไทย ปกติอุดหนุนแต่ร้านที่ขายแถวหอนาฬิกากลางคืน....ใส่ถุงกลับ
1. I bought an egg noodle dish from a well-known Chinese restaurant (for the first time) because I came to the Thai hospital. Usually I support only restaurants that sell near the clock tower at night. They put the food in a plastic bag to take home.

เฮ้ย เพิ่งรู้กลับมา มีแต่น้ำส้มให้ 1 ถุง ไม่มีพริกน้ำตาลให้ เฮ้ย นี่ปกติหรือเป็นแบบนี้ หรือเขาลืม... กรรม นั่งกินจืดๆน้ำตาริน
Hey, what happened! I just came back and found out that they only gave me one little bag of vinegar; there was no sugar and pepper mix. Hey! Is this normal? Or, did they forget....What bad luck! I'm sitting here eating this bland food and my eyes gently weep.

.....

What do you think?

[bambooboy]

That looks pretty good to me David, thanks for that. I like the gently weeping.

To focus on ขำไม่ออก for just second, I think you're right with "can't laugh about" but I'm still a little confused about how it's used.

When you google it a lot of "funny" things show up (eg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6BtWJMWeRc), which at first made me think that it was really meaning the opposite ("can't help laughing about..."). But the more I looked the more it seemed to be used in both ways. For example if you look up the hashtag #ขำไม่ออก on twitter (https://twitter.com/hashtag/%E0%B8%82%E ... D%E0%B8%81) there are examples that seem not funny (eg พรุ่งนี้วันจันทร์ :S #ขำไม่ออก) and some that seem funny (eg เปลกนะรู้ว่ากูไม่ชอบโจ๊กเเต่ก็ซื้อมาให้ ขำเนอะ #ขำไม่ออก).

So I thought that maybe it is used ironically in some cases, to show that something is funny but you shouldn't laugh about it—those videos on youtube for example all seem to be about people getting hurt. Then I thought the English phrase "no laughing matter" is kind of used this way. You can kind of use "no laughing matter" both literally and when you're acknowledging something is funny but don't want to laugh.

So translations of those tweets would read:
1. พรุ่งนี้วันจันทร์ :S #ขำไม่ออก = Tomorrow is Monday :S #nolaughingmatter
2. เปลกนะรู้ว่ากูไม่ชอบโจ๊กเเต่ก็ซื้อมาให้ ขำเนอะ #ขำไม่ออก = It's weird, [they] know I don't like rice porridge, but [they] buy it [for me]. Funny. #nolaughingmatter

Thoughts?

[David and Bui]

["That looks pretty good to me David, thanks for that. I like the gently weeping." (Inspired by The Beatles.)]

[David and Bui]

I like your analysis, Bambooboy. "No laughing matter" is a good interpretation. Let's see what Khun Pirin says.

That looks pretty good to me David, thanks for that. I like the gently weeping.

To focus on ขำไม่ออก for just second, I think you're right with "can't laugh about" but I'm still a little confused about how it's used.

When you google it a lot of "funny" things show up (eg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6BtWJMWeRc), which at first made me think that it was really meaning the opposite ("can't help laughing about..."). But the more I looked the more it seemed to be used in both ways. For example if you look up the hashtag #ขำไม่ออก on twitter (https://twitter.com/hashtag/%E0%B8%82%E ... D%E0%B8%81) there are examples that seem not funny (eg พรุ่งนี้วันจันทร์ :S #ขำไม่ออก) and some that seem funny (eg เปลกนะรู้ว่ากูไม่ชอบโจ๊กเเต่ก็ซื้อมาให้ ขำเนอะ #ขำไม่ออก).

So I thought that maybe it is used ironically in some cases, to show that something is funny but you shouldn't laugh about it—those videos on youtube for example all seem to be about people getting hurt. Then I thought the English phrase "no laughing matter" is kind of used this way. You can kind of use "no laughing matter" both literally and when you're acknowledging something is funny but don't want to laugh.

So translations of those tweets would read:
1. พรุ่งนี้วันจันทร์ :S #ขำไม่ออก = Tomorrow is Monday :S #nolaughingmatter
2. เปลกนะรู้ว่ากูไม่ชอบโจ๊กเเต่ก็ซื้อมาให้ ขำเนอะ #ขำไม่ออก = It's weird, [they] know I don't like rice porridge, but [they] buy it [for me]. Funny. #nolaughingmatter

Thoughts?

[Tgeezer]

Can you guys help me with this phrase? I read it in this sentence: 4 ร้านอาหารเชียงรายที่ขำไม่ออก

I wrote this before opening the thread, but post it in case you find it interesting.
I suppose that you have no trouble with the subject: "4 Chiang Rai restaurants" Followed by a pronoun ที่ (which) followed by a clause describing them, exactly as we would say this in English. There is no classifier so it should read like this: ร้านอาหารเชียงรายสี่ร้าน (which) ขำไม่ออก.
ไม่ออก is applied to verbs like ฟังไม่ออก cannot/ didn't hear. อ่านไม่ออก cannot/didn't read, cannot or didn't depends on the writer and context, ฟังไม่ได้ is unambigously 'cannot'.
There only remains ขำ, what is ขำ that cannot or didn't about the places?
Since the syntax is very English, I would guess that it means cannot be laughed at, for example:Four serious Chiang Rai restaurants.
If something else is said about them then: Four serious Chiang Rai restaurants "which" are friendly/reasonably priced/conveniently located/worth a visit etc.
Although it is fashionable to scatter ที่ around in both English and Thai, it isn't grammatically necessary, however if done often enough it becomes grammatical!

notes: I have looked at the main link but not the others, No laughing matter seems good to me we don't all have the same parlance. On the theme of English and my parlance, he is making something of the bad experiences by writing about them, so he has not 'laughed them off'. Four Chiang Rai Restaurants which I can't laugh off, actually means four experiences of restaurants which I can't laugh off.
Incidentally he is writing in the morning so when he writes วาน he doesn't mean วัน.
Edit: ขำ ว. มีลักษณะที่ชวนให้ชอบและรัก เช่น งามขำ (not in this case) : but here: ขบขัน เช่นนึกขำ
ขัน ก. หัวเราะ, นึกอย่ากหัวเราะ 'amused' from where 'funny' comes I suppose.

[bambooboy]

Thanks Tgeezer, I appreciate the input. Your version makes plenty of sense, too.

I'm still not sure whether ขำไม่ออก could be appropriately replaced with "serious" in other cases, though, where something being funny does seem to be involved. Or at least the potential irony that seems to be involved in the Thai isn't present in simply "serious" (eg a video compilation of people doing funny things would probably not be titled "serious").

[Tgeezer]

Thanks Tgeezer, I appreciate the input. Your version makes plenty of sense, too.

I'm still not sure whether ขำไม่ออก could be appropriately replaced with "serious" in other cases, though, where something being funny does seem to be involved. Or at least the potential irony that seems to be involved in the Thai isn't present in simply "serious" (eg a video compilation of people doing funny things would probably not be titled "serious").

I can't comment on your interpretation of the other links you posted, it sounds very interesting so I shall have a look at them and post again.

ขำไม่ออก is not going to mean serious in all cases but by my reasoning it applies here, let me explain.

The original was only the header, I took it to be text, where 4 ร้านอาหารmที่ขำไม่ออก is not Thai syntax so I assumed that the writer was heavily influenced by English so had to make ขำไม่ออก 'unable to laugh' mean something based on English as describing the restaurant. if the restaurant can't laugh then I make it a serious restaurant.
I had a choice for ขำ because the actual meaning is not ขัน but "of a character which invites liking'. We don't know that the writer didn't mean that, but it wouldn't make much difference if he did because the meaning is in the article.